21
CO-OP? Who needs it? We’re HALO!
Posted under Games, Halo by MrCarpalTunnel 
Seems like GOW will still be the dominant go-to-game for Co-Op Fans of the FPS genra. In a recent quote from CVG; Bungie’s spokeperson stated:
“‘We’re not dumb,’ says Bungie’s Frank O’Conner. ‘We know that people want it and we’re trying to make it happen. I think the biggest problem for us for online co-op is that we have a situation where you can be in a Warthog with five troops, almost a mile away from the other player. That’s a significant challenge. And there’s lots of design things you could do to prevent that from happening, but they would make it not feel like Halo anymore. If we can make it happen in a way that works well, we will - and if it works badly, we won’t.’”
So perhaps all those months of beta-testing and feedback fell on hushed ears. Or did Bungie not realize that Co-Op on GOW (the one game we’ll be comparing Halo 3 to) was the highlight of the game?
To be fair though; Bungie has been under a deadline for the past 3 years to get this game out. And with not much feedback from the community, during the open-beta, it’s hard to feel the pulse of what gamers want!
*For die-hard Halo Fans: The last statement was known as sarcasm to most Gamers.
I agree, I was outraged when I heard that it wouldn’t include online co-op. I can only hope that they’re working on it. If it isn’t in the box, hopefully it’ll be available via an update shortly after release.
outraged? this is so absolutely silly!
If this was not Halo nobody would be nearly as upset, nor would they base the gaming being good on that fact. WHO CARES! With or without that feature its going to be one hell of a ride. yes I would perfer to have it in box, or shortly their after. Still if they should fail to do that it won’t in the least ruin it for me.
I really feel like people are poised to pounce on bungie for any reasone at all what so ever. Saying they set them selves up for that in anyway is just pissy/cynical gamer crap…. Stop listening to the hype, or the bashing and just judge the game for what it is.
If your comparing it to Gears, then yes it loses a round to online co-op, but I guarentee if you dont let the hype and bashing ruin it for you, Halo will at least go all 12…….
Also when comparing games, lets also point out that at least I could not write the Halo story in my sleep(unlike another mentioned game) and not to be a fanboy but MC&The Arbiter would dismantle all the Cogs in a breathe….. Their is no comparison. simply put, they both have failings, and moments of greatness….
QUOTE-Jeremiah — “Stop listening to the hype, or the bashing and just judge the game for what it is.”
Amen! But… look at what happened to Shadowrun. That game got judged for everything that it wasn’t.
In the case of Halo 3, you are especially right. Comparing it to Gears is not fair. The game has been well in production before Epic’s title released. And I’m sure part 3 is built upon the same concept as the first two Halo’s: Free roaming levels but with a linier story. I can understand how that can cause problems for the developers. Gears was magically able to block off every checkpoint so you couldn’t go back nor ever leave your co-op buddy behind.
There is only one Masterchief and Bungie has a grand story to finish with Halo. They are not going to let multiplayer co-op (something this franchise NEVER had in mind) effect that.
I totally agree about Shadowrun, and I’m afraid thats how most real gamers are viewing Halo 3 right now… For all it does not have, its an incredibly good game, and good series. I think it comes down to a matter of perspectives, and what YOU want out of it…. I’m getting nearly everything I want out of from what I can tell…
I can’t wait to hear all the dialogue between MC and The Arbiter.. No matter your perspective, I think this is one story not to be missed…
I don’t care how hard it is, I want it in. Why? Because including online co-op has become a standard feature in most games. We complain and bash Sony’s online plan because we’ve gotten used to Xbox Live. When a standard has been set, anything less than that is unacceptable.
Especially since the Halo games have always had campaign co-op. Originally Halo 2 was planned to have online co-op, but was scrapped due to time and money constraints. Not including it in Halo 3, especially since it has been done so well in other games, is a huge black mark. Even more so since Halo 3 is being touted as the 360’s flagship title.
Games with online co-op: Gears of War, Unreal Tournament 3 (4 player online co-op), Mercenaries 2, Crackdown, Rainbow Six, Two Worlds, Medal of Honor Airborne, Kameo.
If it has been done, then it should be done.
Hell yea I’m comparing it to GOW!!!
Why not? I compare Splinter Cell to Hitman, Forza to Burnout, and Taco Bell to Arbys! It’s a title thats classified as a FPS. As far as FPS games go I am a gamer first and not much of a FANBOY! Sure I have the T Shirts, even own a Master Chief action figure (my wife calls it a doll). However that won’t stop me as a gamer, and a podcaster, to judge it based on it’s competition! Yea it’s HALO: But it’s still just a FPS to me.
And when I judge it, just like I did Shadowrun… It will be based partly on Story and context. SHADOWRUN had NONE! So I did not enjoy it. GOW had very little plot, however it made up for the lack of story with the emersion of gameplay with a friend. I now want more of that feeling.
Leaving this out of HALO3 is just one hell of a letdown for me. I wasn’t that impressed with the BETA, and pound for pound SHADOWRUN was a much more innovative online FPS. So this means I will really have to be taken away with content in HALO3. And now without sharing that with a friend as we battle hand in hand, it had better be some damn good content!
“if it has been done, then it should be done” - Thrill
That seems kind of narrow. First I dont think we know everything here, we don’t have degrees in Game Design, nor do we know enough about these seperate engines, and respective companys to judge that flatly. I really think their is a bit more to it than that. Yet I do not denie your point, its something I would very much like to have, and something I feel should be a major priority. Even still it would be incredibly lame to toss aside such a potentially amazing game, only because we don’t get online co-op at launch(or at all). No matter how you look at it, online co-op does not make or break this game.
True enough Thrill, however in judging games based upon your gameplay life, youhave to balance it against other known factors. In other words: You only knowa Steak is good because of the Bologna sandwich you had at one time.
Also to me Co-Op in this day and age of online gaming is very important to me. Just like people who never go to movies by themselves, or having sex alone. It just isn’t the same. So leaving it aside (from a title of this magnitude) is a let down) Thats just the way I see it.
Look at it this way: If it were not a big deal; why the announcement of the lack thereof? Seems like someone thought an explanation was needed. So do I!
This was taken from Jeramy Perish of EGM so please read it just prooves that as fans we need to not be so quick to jump the gun.
Halo 3 and the art of the Telephone Game
So you obsessive Internet-using types have probably noticed, between poring over leaked scans of Harry Potter book seven, that certain information from the next issue of EGM has begun circulating the Internet. This is despite the fact that the next issue of EGM has not yet actually left the printer’s. The next issue of EGM will therefore be remembered as “The Deathly Hallows Issue.”
The Internet being the Internet, of course, word — that’s every word — spread far and wide the minute the scans went online. Having written half of the article currently being propagated across the world, I’ve been very interested to watch its spread. By “interested” I mean “frustrated,” and not just because I would have liked to have seen the fruits of my labor in person before it became yesterday’s news. Much more irritating is the way that people’s poor reading comprehension and hysterical assumptions have painted an inaccurate picture of the game with just enough credit to the original source to make it looked like the inaccuracies are our fault. And that is not cool.
The entire Internet has descended upon the EGM scans, buzzard-like, to carve themselves a little piece of the action/traffic. I accept that this is simply how things work now. We at 1UP sometimes partake of this shameful act ourselves! But look, Internet people, if you’re going to pick the bones of our cover story clean, please have some integrity about it. That means checking to make sure what you’re writing is actually correct. Yes, I know. Muckraking is easy traffic; sensationalize something and the hits just roll in. Fact-checking is time-consuming and difficult, too, and every second that you don’t have a story posted because you’re double-checking its accuracy is a second that someone else is getting Dugg up. But there’s a reason so many people have so little respect for bloggers, and crap like the OMG NO ONLINE CO-OP IN HALO 3 stories that have been filtering around for the past day is right at the top of the list.
The co-op element of EGM’s story seems to be the one thing that people are latching onto. Halo 3’s campaign mode won’t support online co-op gameplay, the article almost kind of seems to suggest according to a few summaries, making for headlines like “Halo 3 Co-Op Heads Offline.” Bummer, huh? After the awesome experiences we had with Gears of War and Crackdown, it really sucks that Bungie’s not putting online co-op into this game. Time to whip out clever photoshops that use “fail” as a noun! Maybe even some hilariously captioned cat photos that describe Bungie’s ineptitude with ironically poor grammar!
Except… Bungie hasn’t actually denied or ruled out online co-op in Halo 3. What the developers — Frank O’Connor in particular — did say is that they’re still working on it. They’re trying to surmount the technical challenges that are preventing co-op from being as polished as the rest of the game. They know people want it. They want to add it. But as of our interview with them, a month ago, it hadn’t come together yet in a satisfactory manner. That doesn’t mean it won’t happen, and in fact they’d like to make it happen. But they won’t include a half-baked implementation.
Personally, I suspect they’ll get the kinks worked out — and even if the game doesn’t ship with online co-op out of the box, that’s what updates are for. But that’s my speculation, which you shouldn’t confuse with facts. In this case, the facts are that Bungie wants to include online co-op and is working toward that end.
No one’s perfect — hell, I let a small factual error creep into the Halo 3 story, which Bungie seems determined to never ever let me live down — but it’s not hard to sort out the facts when you have our stolen text right there as a reference. All it takes is a little reading comprehension and the willingness not to rely on the Telephone Game as a source for news. You want facts, go find the source. Don’t rely on someone’s impressions of someone else’s write-up of an article that they read furtively before the scans were taken offline. That’s all it takes to elevate yourself from “slapdash dumbass blogger” to “aspiring journalist.”
But perhaps these amateurish hijinks are simply the way of the Internet now. Don’t even get me started on the way people have taken my off-the-cuff impressions and speculation based on an hour with the Metroid Prime 3 demo as hard facts about the entirety of the final product….
Thank you for posting that Gui J!
Unless I misunderstood your post Gui j:
It seems as if we are not allowed to talk, scrutinize, or critique anything until it comes out. That is if we want to appear as journalists.
Well F-That. I’m a gamer first and podcaster second. Not talking about Halo3 on our site would be like not talking about Hillary on Talk radio.
Sure it’s speculation. Sure it may be B.S.. Sure It may be the best game ever! However right now all I got is a BETA and a lot of HYPE. So if I hear on the grapevine (regardless of whose grapevine) I am going to talk about it.
I’m not propagating a rumor, I am propagating my opinion. That’s the entire reason for the cast.
Unless I misunderstood you, it sounds like you were crying about a feature that we dont even know for sure is not in the game. You are taking a leaked quote from the interweb.
Read Excerpt
Bungie hasn’t actually denied or ruled out online co-op in Halo 3. What the developers — Frank O’Connor in particular — did say is that they’re still working on it. They’re trying to surmount the technical challenges that are preventing co-op from being as polished as the rest of the game. They know people want it. They want to add it. But as of our interview with them, a month ago, it hadn’t come together yet in a satisfactory manner. That doesn’t mean it won’t happen, and in fact they’d like to make it happen. But they won’t include a half-baked implementation.
So just from this little bit I get 3 things
1.Bungie knows we want it.
2.Bungie is working on it.
3.Bungie loves us enough not to not insult me by handing it to us if its not really working.
So Im not saying to not voice you opinion, thats what I love about you Carpie. All that I am saying is its kind of stretching it by complaining about a subject that the developer is aware of, and trying to get ready for us.
We can say all day “For as long as it has been in development there is no was it should not be in the game.” I know I have never made a game. Can I speculate, yes I can. But do we know that for sure, really?
So I guess Bungie is screwed either way at this point, gamer will bitch if online co-op is not there, or they will bitch if its absent.
I am just giving my opinion and showing the community why XBL radio is great. We support all opinions even if we do not see eye to eye.
And my opinion is no opinion I will wait till its out.
Then I will tear Bungie a new culo!
I’ll agree that it’s too early to judge Bungie. For all we know online co-op may in fact be included. However, the current rumor is that this feature will be absent, and Carpal (and I, who agree with him) are making our opinions heard.
The argument that “we aren’t developers, it may be too hard” is not valid. When you’re watching a movie, and the special effects aren’t good, or have been done better in another movie, you don’t leave the theater thinking “Well, it may have been too hard, I couldn’t do it”. You leave saying “They could have done that so much better, it sucks compared to the other movie”. Every market is competitive. You have to keep up. What was great 3 years ago is now just OK.
I don’t think that some people are being objective about this issue. People hold “Halo” so close to their hearts that they aren’t willing to accept any criticism. If this were any other game, in this exact same situation (3rd game in a series, which has always had campaign co-op, and promised yet didn’t deliver on it with the 2nd game), then it would be eaten alive. I think it’s time to remove the “Halo” branded blinders.
I think you misunderstand me about “Its too hard” being an excuse. Its about Bungie saying we are working on it, we know you want it, and that we are not going to put it in if does not work right. Bungie is putting together an expansive Multiplayer game that it in itself could sustain itself as a standalone purchase, all while providing an excellent single player experiance worthy of the final installment in the Halo series. So what voice is there to be made. That sounds like bitching to me. It is not like Bungie said its too hard so we are going to put it. “Bungie said (again) we are working on it, we know you want it, and that we are WORKING on it. What more can you ask of them. I may be bitching myself but it is a problem I have been having latley with “gamers” complaining for every little rumor or tibit and disguising it as getting your voice heard, I myself have been guilty of this. Remember thrill you judge the merit of a movie after have seen it. Im done, if you cant see where i am coming from you will never know.
WOW!
We truly are spoiled.
I’m sure you’ve seen that little kid that’s so used to getting his way, finally his parents say no to something and he acts like he’s going to die.
If you can’t give your children everything in the world, you give them the best that you can right? In your heart, you’d love to save up your children’s complete college fund and buy them each a Ferrari when they turn of age. But sometimes, we are faced with REALITY!.
REALITY is what Bungie faces here.
1) The REALITY is that the Online Co-op portion of Halo 3 is not up to snuff.
2) The REALITY is that people are complaining that it is not in the game already before the game is even out.
3) The REALITY after the game comes out will be a half-attempted online co-op where the same people begging for it to be in the game complain about how LIMITED co-op is.
The REALITY is that gamers are spoiled. Instead of looking forward to the ending of the storyline arch here, people are focused on online co-op!!!
Come on? GOWs had little storyline but the co-op was clearly something they worked on instead. Now we have a franchise game that was always centered on the Halo Universe and people are crying for it to change now?
We’re dealing with High Defintion graphics, a massive-detailed storyline, several new weapons, loads of online stat tracking, and a throng of new beasts to lay the smackdown on. But all you can say is “I’m not getting co-op online!”
It’s time for us to grow up. Take that thumb out your mouth, grow a set, and RESPECT those that do what we cannot.
If any of you complaining about Halo 3 Online Co-op can make me a game with Online co-op within the next three years, let me see your product. BUT…before you’re done, I’ll be sure to belittle you by posting blogs all over the place saying your game won’t have 40+ Multiplayer like Resistance does.
“You can’t please all of the people all of the time.”
Let’s act our age fellows and respect the fact that we even have developers out there willing to give us amazing stories to live out on our virtual playgrounds.
MUCH RESPECT TO THE DEVELOPERS!
If you want to talk about reality, then you should realize that the world is a competitive place. If your car mechanic doesn’t do the job he should, you’ll go elsewhere. If your contractor doesn’t do the work he promised, you’ll fire him and get another. It doesn’t matter if they’ve done their best, or the work is too hard…if they don’t get the job done, and others can, then they won’t be hired.
We aren’t acting spoiled. Bungie isn’t doing anyone any favors here. Last time I checked we were paying them for the game (anywhere from 60-130 bucks). They will make millions on Halo 3. That money comes from our pockets. When I spend money on something I expect satisfaction in return. If they can’t deliver what I’m looking for, then I’ll spend my money elsewhere.
Recently All Pro Football came out, and got mediocre reviews. Why? Because people compare it to the competition. If EA manages to put in more features, better graphics, and an overall better game, then is it our fault that we say “APF just wasn’t that good. It could have been if they added _____ feature”? Is it my fault that I compare UT3 to Halo, which will have 4 player online co-op? No it isn’t, because I’ve seen what can be done. (Don’t even get me started on how Halo has an amazing story compared to everything else, which makes up for it. If you have to read books to understand what’s going on in a game, the story isn’t that good.) Everything gets judged compared it to its competition.
Gui J - You’re right in that I will judge Halo 3 only after having played the final game. But since I don’t have the final retail copy, all I can is speculate, and share how I’ll feel if certain features are missing. I’d like to think that I’m not just bitching, as I’m not simply complaining, but giving rational reasons why I’d be upset.
I think that this issue has gotten way off track. I merely pointed to an article I read on a popular gaming site. Then I stated my opinions on it.
I was hoping for a reply on the topic (not the opinion).
I think Thrill is 100% dead on when he stated about a films effects being below par and the attitude patrons would have about it.
Call it Bitching, call it being spoiled. I call it being a consumer with an opinion. If I only talked about things after the fact it would make for a boring show.
Think about this: E3 and PAX as well as lots of other smaller venues for gaming are there for one basic reason: To get you talking about upcoming titles in games. Whats the first thing you do when you see a trailer for a hot new title like BIOshock? If you are like me you speculate. Now imagine if you have been speculating for 6 months to a year and then they said somethin like “this game will only have Single Player”. Are you really not going to discuss is, talk about it, scrutinize it?
We are a gaming Podcast site not journalists. The only thing that matters on LIVE and .0 is our opinions. Without sounding too bitchy it pisses me off when I’m told to shut the F up and not talk about issues I am curious about.
O_O I think I’m just going to step out of this one, it seems like none of us are going to even begin to hear one another. So I’m taking my Legendary reserve and leaving…..
*walks out of the room*
Coll Jeremiah: But there was never an arguement here, only a clarification to some who feel that discussing games and other content is not good for the community.
If I were asked this question today on the street, “What do you think about Halo 3 not having co-op at launch?” I would answer: “That sucks, I for one love playing co-op with friends and was really hoping HALO3 had it built into the game!”
I don’t see an issue with that conversation at all. Show me where it is uncool, bitchy, or stupid and I promise I will refrain. However I feel it is ignorant to tell others to shut-up thier opinions with (Your not a programmer, or you don’t know all, or your opinion means nada!) Thats just lame. Thats why I got on my high horse. I am all about freedom of Speech.
Bungie Weekly Update: 7/20/07
Posted by Frankie at 7/20/2007 3:41 PM PDT
Co-op Hokey Pokey
The Internet’s hair was lit on fire this week and in between running around the kitchen screaming and waiting for the faucet to fill up with the cool water of logic a bunch of hair got torched. Have you ever smelled burnt hair? We’re not recommending you go out and try and A) burn your own hair or B) burn someone else’s hair, but just take our word for it – the smell of burnt hair is the smell of a thousand failures being vomited from the gullet of a tentacled creature hiding in a wet hole. It’s gross.
We didn’t start the fire, but a series of reports that spread from an unfortunate leak of an upcoming issue of U.S. enthusiast magazine Electronic Gaming Monthly spiraled out of control and suddenly reports on the Internet included salacious headlines like “Halo 3 Co-Op Heads Offline” and heads needed to be dipped in ice water in order to prevail.
All we confirmed to EGM for their sweet, mind-twitterpating Campaign reveal (and other massive feature reveal) regarding Cooperative Play in Halo 3’s Campaign is that System Link co-op will be included in Halo 3. Just like we told EGM, we’re aware that people want co-op online but the challenge of getting our complicated A.I. systems, huge game world, and gargantuan encounters neatly packaged and transferring across the Interwebz is a mythic undertaking. Nonetheless, like other elements of Halo 3, online co-op is a feature we’re wrestling with somewhere in a muddy and muggy Florida swamp against a ton-toothed Alligator, but, what we haven’t really talked about is how big the knife we brought to the wrasslin’ match is.
All that said, EGM doesn’t really know whether or not Halo 3 will ship with online co-op, only Bungie knows. The only thing they did know is that co-op was available for split-screen and System Link. As we approach the tail end of development, we will have a clearer picture of whether or not that online feature will be included. Assuming either way would be foolish at this time. We will say more when we feel it’s prudent. Because that’s how we roll.
GUI J, after reading you note here, I realized that this is just another cheap ploy by Bungie and MS get more hype of a title that doesn’t need it. How the hell can they have co-op in split screen AND System Link BUT NOT Xbox Live? HTF is it not possible?
Trust me when I say Halo 3 WILL have online co-op out of the box in September. I’ll bet my life savings on it. Generating Hype is getting old.
-Rust.
wow, what the hell is going on over here? yes bungie said that, they said it like a week ago so it shouldn’t surprise you guys. Second, I feel it should be in the game at launch, other games have done this so why not Halo(maybe it is because MS is rushing it?) Third, I’m sure that if its not there at launch it will come our way as dlc(for what price though). But seriously, no more halo talk please, I’m tired of all the hype over the game, I just want to play it already and not hear anymore about it.
Amen 519 lets go have a beer…on you of course!
I’m sorry. Call me argumentative.
People talk about competition right? If this game has this, then I’ll go play that if you don’t offer me the same thing.
I think that point is quite funny. You’re screaming about a feature that might not be included, but EVEN if it wasn’t, you’d still buy the game.
What competition are you talking about? GOWs? Did you not play them both?
I agree that it’s just more hype but at the end of the day, Master Chief will still ring in the cash with or without those who choose to follow it’s competition.
I just absolutely ABHOR the fact that regular people WITH NO EXPERTISE on the subject of programming want to tell somebody else who’s worked their butt off to get a degree / experience in that arena.
That’s like somebody with no podcasting experience coming to XBL Radio and telling Carpal he’s needs to edit the show down to just one hour because that’s what everybody else does.
How would you like somebody with no expertise in your profession to tell you how to do your job?
Just because you listen to podcasts doesn’t mean you can actually produce one. Just because you play games doesn’t mean you know anything about the difficulties of programming.
If you really feel so strongly about the Online Co-Op issue, DON’T BUY HALO 3 when it comes out. If you can do that, then you’ve proven your point to me.
If you can’t do that, then you’re just another person disrepecting somebody more knowledgable than you simply because you’re not getting your way.
This has very little to do with Halo 3. This has to do with respect.
Bungie doesn’t HAVE to make any game. They do it because we the people love the Halo world. They do it because THEY WANT to give us more. It’s not up to us to determine what they ultimately put in the game.
As for your All Pro Football comments, I have the game. I enjoy the game. Why? Because at the end of the day, I realize hundreds of people worked their tail off to put this game in my hands.
That’s why I spent $60. I’m simply showing them I appreciate their hard work. 2K Sports, EA SPORTS, and even BUNGIE OWE US NOTHING.
O.K. I will concede to see your point LIT and GUI, however if someone did tell me a way to make the podcast better I would do it if I could. Just ask Steve, Rusty, Gui J , TOG and Silent. And I do it for free. Bungie is getting 60 Bucks a tip
So, Litigator, do you buy every game that’s released? Because they ALL have development teams who work their tails off to deliver a finished game.
The “they owe us nothing” comment is truly bizarre. They are selling a product–they want your money, not your love. It’s not like they’re a group of benevolent philanthropists who exist to amuse you, pro bono. The folks at Frito-Lay owe us nothing! I buy their Doritos to show them how much I appreciate them slaving over a hot stove to bring them to me.
If you don’t like something, don’t buy it.
I’m just like everybody else. If I buy something and I don’t like what I’ve bought, THEN I complain. I don’t buy every game, but I rent games and try them out. I’m not an avid gamer. I like to play games because I can. It’s an escape and I’m grateful to every single developer out there working around the clock to produce a game for me whether it’s bad or good.
It is not my place or anybody else to tell Bungie what to put in a game they’ve decided to make for us. We can all give opinions, but do we own Bungie? Are our butts on the line if something is not flawless? Are we going to get fired if online co-op comes out all glitchy and people complain to the high heavens about it?
I work at a security company as a programmer and I get this junk all the time. Customers think they should dictate how the business is run.
Wrong. It is a luxury to have a secuirty system. Just like it’s a luxury to have a video game.
We should all appreciate the fact that Bungie is working hard to finish the series. Once the game comes out, then we can judge it. We earn that right of judgement because we’ve paid $60 for Halo 3. Until then, it’s not fair or respectful to throw a company that hasn’t failed us yet under the bus.
Who knows? By the time you finish playing through the campaign alone or fragging during multiplayer, you might be so blown away, this may not even matter.
Sorry Liti, but I don’t think you could be more wrong.
I’ve never made a movie, yet I could tell you why a film isn’t good.
I’m not a five star chef, but I can tell you which restaurant is better.
I’m not a podcast producer, yet I can tell how it could be improved.
I’m not a videogame developer, but my review of Vampire Rain is perfectly valid.
I’m not an artist, but I can tell you what artwork strikes me and why.
If first hand experience was required in order to form an opinion, then I couldn’t comment on very many things. No one could. We’d have no Roper and Ebert, no IGNs or Gamespots.
Our point of view, despite our lack of development know-how, is perfectly valid. I feel like I’ve said this a million times now: If the competition delivers something that you can’t, then it will work against you. We don’t care how hard it may be to implement, if someone has done it before then we expect it.
If you enjoy games because hundreds of people worked their tail off, then I suggest you check out Vampire Rain. I hear that people worked extra hard on that one. If a doctor worked super duper extra hard, yet did a horrible job, while another doctor worked half as hard, yet did an excellent job, you wouldn’t go to the first doctor. Results are all that matter. Getting an ‘A’ for effort doesn’t apply in the real world.
Mik - I totally agree with you. Bungie, or any developer for that matter, is not doing charity work. They are a business, and doing what makes economic sense. If Halo 4 comes out, free of charge, then I’ll give Bungie a great big hug and say thank you. Until then, it’ll be strictly a business relationship.
Thats why I love this stuff. Some talk with their emotions, and then SMAKOLA! That frickin’ common-sense LOGIC is used. I know sometimes it tastes bad, but just swallow it and after awhile you get used to the taste
Hmmm. Okay.
We’re going to have to agree to disagree on this subject.
You pick and choose arguments that you can fight against; however, your points still rest on the fact that anybody anywhere can say anything without knowing what they’re talking about.
That’s your point.
If you argue that, then you’d be a hypocrite.
It is simple…if you(as a consumer) don’t get what you want from Bungie, you’ll go elsewhere right?
So tell me Thrillhouse…if Bungie says tomorrow there’s definitely no Co-Op online, are you still going to buy the game?
If yes…then you have no point.
If no…then you’ve proven Halo 3 is in danger of being an incomplete game and thus, not selling as well as this “competition” you keep mentioning.
People wonder why this world is so screwed up right now. Because people feel like they should get everything they want and if they don’t get it, then it’s not right.
Maybe that’s just my upbringing affecting my outlook.
But if Bungie made an announcement tomorrow that due to all the complaints about online co-op, they were cancelling Halo 3 and permanently shelving the series, that would prove my point.
Without Bungie, there’s no game. Fans or not…consumers or not….without Bungie…there is nothing to play, nothing to complain about…there’s simply no Halo 3.
I’m sure I’ve been around competition a lot longer than most Gamers. And Lit I need to let you know that what your suggesting makes no sense.
1. If I buy HALO 3 (but have issues with some features) I am a hypocrite?
Dude that totally makes no sense. I can like parts of a movie/a few songs off an album/some features of the Marketplace.
Please try to raise the bar on your arguements if you want people to take your side. What you are suggesting makes no valid consumer sense. I’m not calling you out, or even trying to come off as RIGHT. I just want to make sure you understand that you can have opposing viewpoints; however if they make utterly no logical sense: you are not doing your side any favors.
Logical sense? Okay.
My point is that you’re complaining about an issue which can be easily fixed through a update on Xbox Live.
You haven’t bought Halo 3 yet, but you’re already complaining?
After you’ve bought Halo 3 and after you’ve played through the game, if you still feel cheated from not having online co-op, then you have every right to complain to Bungie.
To me, Halo doesn’t even need online co-op. The game is center on MASTER CHIEF and the Arbiter on solo missions. Basically the game has always centered around one tough bad guy taking down a whole HORDE of enemies.
It’s not like GOW, GRAW, or Rainbow where TEAMWORK is part of the main game.
Now if Bungie was going to make Master Chief and Arbiter work together during the game, then it would make complete sense for there to be online co-op.
Basically, I’m just saying chill until the game comes out and then judge it after you’ve paid your $60 for it.
It’s like me dissing the PS3 even though I never played on it before. It was completely stupid. It’s like somebody that never had Xbox Live complaining about it.
That’s how you and Thrill look here. You’re complaining about something that you’ve haven’t played yet. Opinions are one thing…but saying a company owes you something totally makes no sense.
By bad…I meant…well Bad(butt but use the other word)
LIT please follow me here…
1. On Reviewing HALO:
We are a Gaming news show. We have to talk about upcoming titles before they are released. It stirrs up interest. If BUNGIE didnt’t want us t talk about it they wouldn’t be releasing statements every week or so and having an open BETA!
2. The dissing the PS3 before playing it, comment:
YOU CAN! I can diss what a turd would taste like. Can’t you? Or do I need to squat before I talk to you about it?
3. PLEASE TRY TO GRASP THIS CONCEPT:
We discuss games, news, companies, tech and ouselves. It’s what makes the show semi-entertaining. If we omitted a game from our conversations we would be justa talk show.
I hate the fact that HALO is so popular that when a statement is made about it, that I find interesting, you can’t grasp why I would talk about it.
Don’t call it BITCHING because you don’t agree with it. I mean we diss plenty of games on this site. Only HALO has these “HALO can do no wrong” players that respond.
If you want HYPE on HALO there is PODtacular. A very loyal, informative cast geared towards HALO love.
We are a cast geared towards truth in opinions (no MVP/free Game/or paid trips to PAX here) we owe nothing to the developers. They work for us. For my entertainment dollar. And when something doesn’t juve well with that (from the Iphone to Marketplace Content) We will continue to rag on it.
-Tried to put it clearly, Carpal Out
I completely understand your agrument.
I also understand that educated opinions help forums like this thrive.
What I don’t understand is why people don’t believe Bungie will take care of us in the end? If Bungie is working for us as you put it, then why would they want to put anything sub-par into your game which could damage that relationship.
Supply and demand. Without one, the other doesn’t exist.
No two people are alike. So why should every game have all the same features? Halo’s storyline doesn’t lend itself to it online co-op.
My educated opinion:
1) Bungie has always given me a quality product to play
2) From what I already know, there’s more than enough in the game to satisfy it’s $60 price point.
3) I know that online co-op not being in the game won’t stop anybody from buying Halo 3. It would add to the replay value but it’s not necessary.
I think that’s why a lot of you don’t like Shadowrun. It’s different than regular shooters. But that should not matter. The only thing that should matter is does the game satisfy the $60. Maybe it fails there, but just because it’s different doesn’t automatically make it bad for business.
Just ask yourself…if there is no online co-op, will I still buy the game? Is that feature a make or break issue for Halo 3?
Gui J says all the time “Don’t let the marketplace dictate you. You dictate the marketplace.” The truth, Mr. Carpal, is that money speaks louder than anything. Come September, online co-op will be the last thing on gamer’s minds.
As for your personal comments towards my character, I bare no ill will. I’m no Halo fanboy. I don’t honestly even care for the storyline.
However, I will check out the “competition” and I’ll be sure to notate anything and everything they do over there differently.
Then I’ll come back to XBL Radio and tell you what features your shows lack.
After all, you’re one podcast in the sea of many competing for my attention. If you don’t have all the features the rest of the shows have, that must mean XBL Radio is not as good as the rest?
Now…that’s only according to your logic…
Liti - This argument is going way off track.
We are not arguing Halo 3’s inevitable sales numbers. We are not arguing that Halo 3 will have a lengthy campaign and large multiplayer component. We are not arguing Bungie’s past/future quality. The only thing that we are arguing is the inclusion of co-op.
I’ll break it down as simple as possible:
Halo has ALWAYS had campaign co-op. Halo 2 was originally scheduled to include online co-op, yet was scrapped. In Halo 3 Master Chief and the Arbiter WILL be fighting together, in the same battles (Bungie confirmed this at E3). Therefore online co-op in Halo 3 was a feature that many looked forward to. This is why the current rumor upsets so many people.
Add the fact that other games have successfully pulled off online co-op, and you have many angry gamers scratching their heads thinking “If they did, why can’t you?”.
As for your comments about XBL Radio, you aren’t wrong. If the podcast, or the site, doesn’t have the features you look for, or fails to hold your attention, then perhaps another site is in fact better for you.
I think you’re finally starting to grasp the whole competition aspect of the world.
But you’ve never podcasted, so are you even capable of giving an educated opinion? According to your logic…
I honestly wasn’t telling you to stop listening, I was telling you that there are sites that praise heavily certain games. We only discuss, and praise if we like. There were no personal attacks made. I’m sorry if you took it that way.
However come sep your right, those who have already made up their minds will buy it. I doubt that those are the same who want to hear opinions about the game from a caster like me. However those on the fence (who listen to us for reviews) and yes there are people who do, will certainly take the lack of co-op into consideration. Believe it or not there are many who think HALO is a simplistic campain FPS (thats not to deep for those who need interpitation) Those people will have to be sold on features, after playing the BETA I can honestly say HALO3 has not added many new ones that “I” have been impressed by. CO-OP would have surely been an enourmous plus.
If you are that interested in this debate listen to our review of GOW. I gave it a 10. Not because Cliffy B. sent me a free copy, not because I love MS, it was due to the FUN that I had while playing through the entire game with TOG.
There are literally hundreds of FPS games that I can go online and kill others on. There are very few that I can sign into LIVE and have an ADVENTURE with a friend that we will remember for years. (I can’t remember 0ne night of matchmaking from another!) And as much as I enjoy HALO 2 multi-player, it’s more a viral stimulant than an entertaining diversion.
Point taken.
OH…I’m not going anywhere. I love XBL Radio. I’m not shaken by words. This is a forum where we discuss issues.
My gaming choices don’t dictate who I am. So you did not offend me, I was merely refuting the Haloboy syndrome.
Now according to Thrill, it was confirmed that both Arb and Chief will be working together at EA. Perhaps I feel asleep during that segment or something. I just missed that news. If that’s the case, then your opinions seem to have merit. However, I will not pass judgment on heresay, I will wait until I have the game in my hands and then respond if Bungie fails to produce an update to add replay value to the game.
As for podcasting, yes…I’ve done my share. It was totally different arena, but it gave me an incredible amount of respect for all podcasters out there. That’s why I listen to XBL. Not because they’re MVP status, but because I like their overall presentation and style.
I don’t look at the features, I look at the entire presentation and base my opinion off that.
However…everybody has their own opinions and is granted them.
I will just wait until September comes and then cash mine out of Halo 3 then.
I really butchered that last line…but I think you get the point.
Well, if nothing else Carpal you sure stirred up the hornet’s nest. 44 comments and counting! You should be proud.
anymore off topic and I will be forced to lock this thread, sorry.
Did someone say something to Steve, or does he seem like a Midget at a Barstool Spinning competition?
Just kidding:-)
no one said anything
Add A Comment